A few weeks ago, Carolyn Topol Talk had the honor and privilege of interviewing the multi-talented actor and author, Thaao Penghlis!  Thaao is currently one of the stars of Days of Our Lives and he has written two books, Places – The Journey of My Days, My Lives, and Seducing Celebrities One Meal at a Time.  As we began our discussion, he was making Greek coffee, and graciously explained to this “Turkish coffee” lover that when the Ottoman’s took over Constantinople the name Turkish coffee was assumed.  Clearly it is “Greek coffee” that I enjoy.

In addition, Thaao generously shared information about his life on and off screen.  He was a pleasure to speak with and, especially, to learn from.

Carolyn Topol Talk:  When you first came to the United States, I understand it was not to go into acting?

Thaao Penghlis:  No, I was in the diplomatic corps. I was in Sydney [Australia], and was doing really well at. I got high grades, partly because I happened to save the day one time when everybody missed the launch to go out to climb on board [an incoming] ship to interview 500 women coming from Greece. Everybody that morning missed the launch except me so I had to do five people’s work. By the time the boat slowly came into port, Immigration was afraid that it would get out about the way we were treating immigrants, but I told them I had done the job. So I got this huge grade up that they told me normally takes 10 years. They also told me I was the first Greek that’s worked to that level. Little did I know, there were some Greeks who were taking money — and so were others who I was working with. I didn’t know why everybody else was so rich — I didn’t know how everyone was getting so rich on that salary.

CTT:  And then you came to the US?

TP:  Yes. The book, Places, in the first chapter, “Along the Path,” talks about it being predicted, during an interview with a psychic from Scotland Yard, that I would leave within a year, become an actor, and play a character that was diabolical for many years. That chapter I really like because it’s all about my twenties. They were my most influential years, I think, because I didn’t know what I was searching for. I just left because I needed to find some mentoring. By going to New York, I was this kind of innocent boy who went to New York and had to learn fast. I was blessed, really, because many people who crossed my path were great in their profession and great as people. Like everywhere else, you also meet the snakes. They’re part of what helps polish your intuition. Those years were fantastic. I went to New York and worked for the UN [United Nations] for one year, with the Australian mission to the UN. I went back home after a year and I missed America. I only remained for eight days in Australia. I went back to [work for] Immigration and realized I couldn’t work for those people anymore. There was too much dishonesty. Being raised poor I couldn’t take advantage, and reported two people who were then fired.  You’re always searching for your truth, and it comes in many ways if you listen. I had many great teachers over the years, and I finally became an American citizen when [Barack] Obama came in, and I wanted to vote for him. [Short pause]

I was in so many fields — in the art world; in the fashion world.

CTT:  You were on the stage to start with?

TP:  Yes, I did several off-Broadway plays and I wasn’t very good in them. I remember my first time in a class that someone brought me to — I said, “I don’t want to be an actor,” but I went to observe because it’s good psychologically to understand how people think and interpret things. The teacher turned to me, while I was there as a guest, and said, “Why don’t you get up and read.” I said, “I’m sorry, I’m just a guest here,” and the teacher replied, “No, I want hear you read.” I thought, ‘Oh my God, what am I doing here?’ I was not comfortable in my physical self. I was awkward and stiff. She [the teacher] said, “It’s a good thing you don’t want to be an actor because I couldn’t tell the difference between you and the chair.” I was so upset and embarrassed. The girl next to me said, “Don’t worry, you’re pretty.” That girl, today, is still a friend of mine and we connect on Facebook.

CTT:  That’s fabulous.

TP:  Yes. Maggie Frawley and I did some really good work together. Just to prove a point, it took me two years, but I became top of the class in that workshop. That’s how hard I worked. I was not going to go home until I proved myself to my family. I said to myself that I’m going to study as an actor; I’m going to really do well at. It took me a long time to get my papers, but by the time I was 29 I got my first job. Then I went home — I hadn’t been home for six years.

CTT:  You have quite an extensive acting history. You worked on Mission Impossible, didn’t you?

TP:  Yes that was the thing that brought me back home, but Days of Our Lives was the thing that got me recognized in Australia. It was huge there. I remember calling my sister and asking her if that was going to upset her? She said, “You’re going to ruin my soap! I’m not going to believe the show now because my brother is in it.” Then she started to watch and it worked. What’s interesting is, after all these years, my brother and his wife are now watching. He said, “Why didn’t you tell me the show is this good?” He said, “I used to hear about Days, but it seemed like only women were watching it. My wife and I can’t wait to go home and watch it.” Even now, with all the negatives people throw around about soaps, it’s good to have my brother, who’s very critical, say to me that he likes the show — he doesn’t like this character or he loves that character, but he loves the show. He gets enthused.

CTT:  That’s terrific! I think the soaps have a lot to give to everybody who actually pays attention and gives them a chance. You were on General Hospital too?

TP:  That was how it started. I had the opportunity to go on the stage, but I made another choice. I went where I could make more money because, when actors start out, there’s very little money and those of us who do survive are fortunate. I was tired of being poor, and I don’t mean just in America. I was poor when I was a kid.  Everything was restricted because we didn’t have a lot of money. All of that influences you. That’s why I can be a spendthrift and why I’ve even bought tickets for my friends to go overseas with me. When you’ve been in that position you’re much more sensitive to it. I look at others in that position and can understand what they’re going through. I try to give in places where I can.  I give to charity a lot. Today I give to take care of an Egyptian family because I had gotten to know them. I thought if I can help one family — make a difference for them — then that’s a good contribution. Giving [money] to charities, we don’t always know where the money goes to. Now, I support the Syrian children.

CTT:  On a lighter note, would you please share a little bit about your journey on Days?  While playing two roles, you successfully created two distinct characters. (Thaao Penghlis pictured below with Days co-stars Christopher Sean and Eric Martsolf.)

TP:  When I was approached, so long ago [in regards to playing the dual roles of Tony and Andre], I decided to make a distinct differentiation between the two. One was a perfect example of who you would want to be, as I would see it, and the other one was more envious because he didn’t have those qualities — he had to manipulate them. I remember, even when Andre was running around, escaped, and he was working in some repertory company, I thought, ‘Let’s see if I can bring some humor to this character.’ I got to like Andre more than I did Tony. It’s because I remember doing Richard III, and I decided to come off stage so you could only see part of my face. I just made him look kind of fragile, tragic, and hilarious if I could.

The crew are very good barometers for me. I found that even though Tony was good, dressed well, was the ladies’ man — knew how to take the chair when the lady was to be seated — have the politeness, the manners, he became more or less someone you could always trust, but Andre was unpredictable. He was like the clown. Once I put on the clown outfit, I went crazy. He would do things I would never do. I thought this is that maniacal person everyone would look at with disdain, but I found I enjoyed it a lot, except when I had to play the South American and had to dress up as a woman. I thought, ‘There are men who could dress up as a woman and look great, and I look more like a hooker from Brazil?’ Everybody was making fun of me on the set, which I didn’t like, so I threw in the line, when I caught a glimpse of myself in the mirror, “My God, you’re one ugly broad!”before anyone else could say that. I beat them to the punch.

The fact remains that I could be killed five or six times, and come back for some reason. I was the first DiMera. I was there before Joe [Mascolo]. We were studying in the same class and I recommended him to come on. I thought he could play my father, so Joe came on after six months, and we took it from there. Both of us were actors who were demanding of ourselves. Joe was a perfectionist. He was a good influence.

CTT:  The two of you built a soap opera family.

TP:  Yes.

CTT:  Soap opera families — core families — are incredibly important to the fans. It doesn’t matter if they are the ‘good’ family or the ‘bad’ family. You really developed that family.

TP:  Yes, even though Billy [Flynn] is a DiMera, The first time I saw him I thought well he’s not really a DiMera. He doesn’t have the look, and he didn’t have that kind of a passion that Joe and I had about things. Yet, he’s been able to, because people have said that we have that chemistry. Right away he and I got along — not always, but most of the time. We made it believable. It was an exercise.  It wasn’t like Joe and I, as father and son — you could see we were both dark and had the European look. Then Chad comes in (the first one) [played by Casey Deidrick]  and he was not very much like a DiMera. The reason the DiMeras have stayed, is because Joe and I were core trained actors who have boundaries. Because he was my father I knew how far I could go. Today they don’t do that. They speak to you as though you’re just another person. There are no boundaries in life. The reason we have transitions every decade is because it helps you build your character, so one day you’ll be able to turn around and face whatever it is that’s coming at you and say, “I’m secure enough because of my foundation.” If you don’t build a foundation, you’re not going to get an audience to believe, because you’re missing something. That’s why I’ve had to work with Billy. I said, “You can’t talk to me that way.” I didn’t like the fact that he [as Chad DiMera] got all the inheritance when I was close to our father and was the original DiMera. I just think that was a mistake on the part of the previous writer. But hopefully, now. all those things will change.

You reach an age, and the younger people have to look up, just like I did. I gave that person the right to be who they were, or are, because of their age and because of their experience. Billy will say, “I really respect Thaao.” It also depends on the dialogue and where you place it. It also depends on what you become. The young ones are still learning because their training is not as extensive as ours, nor did they go through the difficulties. Today, if you’re pretty, there’s more reason for you to have success whereas, in our day, it was a distraction. They wanted actors. All those actors who started in New York, and who were brought up with the Jewish theater, and had a fantastic history — now it’s different.

CTT:  How was it reuniting with Leann Hunley?

TP:  Well, you see, Leann and I were very good friends. You can’t always say that about everybody you work with. The people I’m close with at work now are Lauren [Koslow], and her husband, and Kristian [Alfonso]. We socialize with each other — Deidre [Hal] as well.

You know, there are some people that come into your life and you’re constantly making an adjustment, but Leann is the kind of human being that if I hadn’t seen her for 10 years we would pick up from where we left off, without any transitions. It was great to have her working. I’d like to see Leann back; I like working with Leann. I also like working with Lauren, so I’ve been fortunate. I also like working with Deidre.

CTT:  As a long-time viewer, having Kate and Andre living in the same home has been strange, but it’s been very amusing.

TP:  The two of us [Lauren Koslow and Thaao Penghlis], played crooks on Days of Our Lives, and then we try to rectify that, and then we persevered. Because we know each other, what comes out of it, is humorous. It becomes funny because of the way we played it — it’s not necessarily written in there.

CTT:  You and Lauren clearly are comfortable on screen working opposite one another.

TP:  Yes, and it also could be that we really care about each other. She is one of my favorites. She has said to me that she hopes they put us together, because she’s been wanting to work with me for years. The chemistry was there already; we didn’t have to search for that. That kind of chemistry is not always available.

CTT:  Whenever Andre is on, there only appears to be good feedback.

TP:  When I first came back [to Days], a lot of people said they wanted to have Tony back because I [Andre] wasn’t the most sexual object around, like Tony was. It wasn’t an easy thing to do — to get the audience to like you. I think we played well with social media. They [fans] got to see another side of me — personally.  The journeys I’ve taken, the things that I would bring to social media, the monasteries that I would go to. It was a lovely way, I thought, of people showing their feelings toward me. They would say that they’re not particularly crazy about my character, but like me because I share things and inspire. For Andre, the thing that I think saved his ass, was his humor. It was like, ‘how do you get water out of a rock; how do you get humor out of something that’s really serious?’ Well, you have to find a way — it’s there. To me, you find the love in the scene and you keep secret how you will do the scene differently from the way you started it.

CTT:  Well it’s definitely working because people love when you’re on.

TP:  I didn’t like the name Andre, to be honest with you. I’m not an ‘Andre’. I just wish they had given me a different name. I like the name ‘Tony’. When I was doing Mission Impossible, they asked me what kind of name I would like for the character? I thought, ‘Wow, that’s a first.’ I said, “I always liked the name Nicholas,” and they added ‘Black’ because I had dark hair and dark features, so the character was Nicholas Black. But when it came to Andre, because he was long established, I didn’t think he would be the one to survive the epic journey. I always thought it would be Tony. The last producer had me fall on a spike, and I thought, ‘That was how you kill a vampire.’ That was nasty — it was like saying that you’re not coming back. I said to the stage manager, when I saw this producer coming in, and I didn’t know who he was (actor or producer) — I thought, if he’s an actor, he should play Iago just by the way he walked in… and he was my Iago. He had me killed with a spike going through my heart. It was like he was out to kill me personally.

I’ll give you a real personal story. When I went to the monastery at Mount Athos, in Greece — it is one of the most sacred places in the Christian world, it’s where it all started with the Virgin Mary — I brought back Holy water and Holy oil for people. I shared holy candles and icons with them. I felt blessed by being there because no women are allowed, only men. It’s monasticism. I gave the gifts to one of my producers, and my producer said to me, “I’ve never seen another male actor on this show be as kind.” It really reached the depths of someone’s soul when I brought that back. That’s what team playing is all about, as opposed to an individual success. Some people are team players and others are just for themselves, that’s part of what they have to work out. We’re not all the same and we have differentiation’s. I was glad I did that and thought, ‘Wow,’ to see people moved by something that was so rare and so human.

Even though I play Andre, I know how to bring some soul there. One day, this aired recently, when Abigail [DiMera] said to me, “Why are you helping me, why are you helping me?” I turned around and threw in the line, because it was not there in the writing, “Because you’re the only family I have left.” I feel the writers picked up on that because, later on, they bring that up. It’s suddenly grounded the character and made the audience realize that’s why he’s like that. I gave [viewers] the human elements. It also helped the audience like the character more because they’re beginning to understand him more, while previously he was more of a cartoon.

CTT:  I agree. I think Andre was originally more of a caricature.

TP:  Yes.

CTT:  A new level of connecting continues with the book you have written. When did you start writing? Is this something you’ve always done?

TP:  No, not really. An assistant of mine, a long time ago, said that I tell really good short stories and should write. I left others to the writing. My interest was more in the investigating to find my correct path.

I remember one day I went to the Discovery Channel and presented them with the book, Places. It was really about me going and resolving histories, or bringing history into focus. What’s been missed out on by evidence that is applicable today. I had just come back from Syria in 2010, and I went to Discovery four times (in New York). They said they were so excited and were going to do the show with me, which was going to be called Mission Possible. I told them the stories and they liked how I told the stories. They were pleased that I also knew how to tell a story. I didn’t really hear it then. They asked if I would be ready in two weeks to start on the show, and I said, “Yes.” I had just finished Days.

Two weeks later I got a call from my agent telling me my producer had just been fired, and the head of National Geographic had moved to Discovery and was cleaning the slate. So I had all this information left from all I’d worked on, and that’s how the book got started. Someone suggested to write about it. I began to write stories and someone suggested I share the stories on the stage where I would host. So I did the one man show, and realized I could take it around the country. Then Days came again, so I had to put it aside, but at least the book was written. With my parents, as I’m sure with everyone’s, we can’t always collect our histories. Years later we look back and wish we had asked our parents this or that question. I wrote this as the bible of our history; of someone in our who family tried to make a difference. It’s funny because recently a cousin of mine commented on the way I made a big difference in our family’s name.

How do you see people, including relatives? They don’t always tell you. To me, it’s about how you make a difference. I’m not sure my parents ever asked themselves that question. For me it’s about how do I shift things in life so they can grow and somebody else can take it from there and make it shift into their lives as well. I think that’s where all the writing began. And then the Seducing book came about when I realized how many people had crossed my path — celebrities — because I love cooking.

A third book, which I’m starting, about monasticism and why I’m attracted to monks and why I like spending time in their company. I think part of it is the fact that there is silence and there is quietness, and there’s a way of getting in touch with yourself that aberrations of spirit, like noise or motorcycles, or traffic, or people screaming and shouting are sliced away — to go somewhere where it’s quiet.

CTT:  It’s wonderful that you’re able to share all this with everybody. The book sounds so enriching, bringing us on a new journey, following those of your previous two books.

TP:  Kristian Alfonso took my book to Athens and texted me, I can’t put your book down. I can’t believe you wrote all this. I’m giving it to my husband to read as well. It’s inspiring me.

I remember there was a 19th-century cleric here in this country who turned around and said, “It’s not how much we’ve accomplished in this lifetime, it’s about the distance we have traveled from the point of where we started.” It applies to me because I came over here with $180 in my pocket, and look at the distance I have traveled.

There is something innocent about having started from scratch, where there was no manipulation, it was just about survival. Billy and Casey [Moss] both look to me to ask questions, and I laugh because I did the same thing when I was their age. I was looking for the same thing. It’s the whole thing with Greeks and mentoring — it’s a very important thing. It’s very difficult to get mentored by your family. You have to make your own choice. The choices I made certainly worked — not all, but most. Mentors made a big difference; taught me what to be and what not to be, by example. You appreciate those things.

CTT:  When you were traveling, towards the end of one of your trips you tweeted something, to the effect of, everybody told you not to go, warning you it wouldn’t be safe, and, yet, you felt very safe. Was that your trip to Egypt?

TP:  Yes, that was it.

CTT:  You go to all these exotic places that many people don’t get to go to. Have you ever been fearful? Has anything ever happened?

TP:  Let me put it this way, the young psychic with E! Television Network, Tyler Henry, — I was his first client. His manager called me and asked to have him read me? He was starting out and his manager told me he’s really very good. I agreed. He came to my house — he was 17 at the time — he looked around and said, “Your mother and your father are here, Ava and Peter. Is that your parents?” And I said, “Yes.” He asked me if I knew how many times I’d almost died on these journeys I take — five. I said, “Really?” He started to mention them. To answer your question, yes, it was Egypt.

I lost a friend because of that. They were screaming at me. Even my executive producer screamed at me and told me I was crazy. I had to go, following my intuition. I did go to Egypt last July. I wanted to go to the Monastery at St. Anthony, where monasticism started. I wanted to know what it was like in the third century and how that began, and how that influenced Mount Athos and St. Catherine’s monastery in Sinai. They were calling me up and screaming at me that I was absolutely crazy doing these things, telling me they didn’t understand me. Well, I didn’t have the fear factor in those areas. It was interesting because during the last week, I didn’t hear from anyone. Not one person called me up. When I got back, I called that person and asked after throwing out all those negatives about me going, I was wondering why they didn’t wish me well when I was leaving, and they said, “I have to call you back.” I thought something happened. This has been since last July, and I have not spoken to that person since. This is somebody who couldn’t deal with the fact that I came back and I said how well it all was. I had a guide who was taking me to many places in Cairo. He took me three hours into the desert. I asked if there was anything with [Isis] around?

I have to be honest with you, that negativity that people threw around, I thought about on the plane going to Egypt. I thought to myself, ‘I hope this is not a mistake,’ but when people throw that information out at you, it starts to play on your mind. When I went out there it happened to be Ramadan. It was 100 degrees. Nobody was around. I sat with the monks and they were wonderful to me I had a wonderful experience.

Two days later a friend of mine from the East Coast came, and I said, “Let me show you Egypt.” We went on a ride along the Nile and everything was perfect. I took him to certain churches from ancient Cairo. About six weeks later, one of the churches we went to was bombed, killing 25 people. I think you follow your intuition, but you also have to be smart about where you’re going. This was why I don’t go with groups, because [the terrorists] want to make as much noise as possible. None of the places I went to had large groups because all were afraid, like my friends here were. There are definitely those dangerous places — certainly Morocco — you’ll read that in the book. Morocco is where I went out and came back because it was dangerous. They tried to pickpocket me, surrounding me. Then, when I went up to my room I heard a scream and someone was being murdered below me. I went to Casablanca, which was the worst, with all these men coming at me in the Shuk and tried to pickpocket me, and I laughed because I had left everything in the hotel room so there was nothing they could steal — not even a watch or necklace. I was able to walk away because I had nothing for them to take. I feel that Greece and Italy are probably the safest places now in Europe.

CTT:  It’s definitely complicated being in Europe now.

TP:  It is, and also because I want to do my stories, it wouldn’t work now because no one’s going to go there. No crews are going to go and take you there.

Sheri Anderson, who is now on Days, and I have written some scripts that are being looked at seriously. Writing, in my later years, is becoming something to focus on.

CTT:  We look forward to the next book.  The first two are great reads!

TP:  The trick is, when you tell a story, you help the person and make it seem as if they are going with you. You also have to listen. A lot of people tell stories and don’t listen to their audiences, and you have to listen. If you’re not listening, and the stories are going over their heads, you’re wasting everybody’s time. How do you connect to that? You have to connect from your core. The story doesn’t come from you, it comes through you, and there’s a big difference. When the story comes through you there’s a purity about it, and people feel that energy.

Years ago, a psychic who was at a benefit I did for 400 women, was sitting in the front row. She came backstage and said to me, “That was an interesting exercise today. The first hour you held everybody in your hand because it was coming through you, but then when you saw how much you were enjoyed, and you were gloating, it started coming from your ego. Remember, it has to come through you, not from you.”

CTT:  Thank you so much for all you have shared and all you continue to share.  You inspire.

*****

It was a pleasure to listen to Thaao Penghlis.  We could have spent hours with him, as he shared his journey.  This briefly touches the surface of this extremely interesting, engaging, and inspiring person.

Please enjoy both of Thaao’s books.  They are available through a variety of sources, both in print and ebook formats.